#513 – Walmart Beta Programs, Google Ads, & AMA

Video of the episode at the bottom

Get ready to take your Walmart selling game to the next level! Our brilliant guest, Michal Chapnick, a Walmart expert, talks about Walmart’s ad certification, the unveiling of innovative beta programs, and the integration of Google ads into promoting your Walmart products. She’ll also shed light on Walmart’s commitment to third-party sellers through initiatives like fee discounts and personalized product suggestions. This is the inside scoop you need to unlock the potential of Walmart’s marketplace and see your sales soar.

Discover the power of Google ads in driving traffic to Walmart and how it can work wonders for your brand exposure. Dive into the advantages of Walmart’s SEM program and learn why it may be more beneficial than directly sending Google ads to Walmart. Michal reveals the abundant opportunities awaiting sellers at Walmart Canada and uncovers the potential impact of beta programs, such as brand stores, on your sales figures. This Walmart Wednesday episode is packed with insights and advice for those seeking to extend their business reach on Walmart.

As we approach Q4, the busiest time for e-commerce, Michal shares her expertise on maximizing your sales during this hectic period. From planning and implementing promotions to optimizing your listings and enhancing customer service, we’ve got you covered. Uncover the impact of the beta version of coupon codes and the power of video ads in holding customer attention. We wrap up our episode by acknowledging all the diligent sellers out there and remind you to make the most of the opportunities available on Walmart’s platform, particularly during the holiday season. Buckle up for a wealth of knowledge, and best wishes for a profitable Q4!

In episode 513 of the Serious Sellers Podcast, Carrie and Michal discuss:

  • 00:00 – Selling on Walmart Updates and Opportunities
  • 03:13 – BIS Mentor and Customized Suggestions
  • 06:07 – The Growth and Opportunities With Walmart
  • 12:35 – Walmart’s Influence on Black Friday Sales
  • 15:23 – Running Ads for Walmart Benefits
  • 19:17 – Opportunities for Selling in Walmart Canada 
  • 23:53 – Promoting Walmart Sales With Coupons and Videos
  • 31:56 – Optimizing Keywords With Helium 10
  • 33:24 – Q4 Selling Tactics and Appreciation

Transcript

Carrie Miller:

On today’s episode we have Walmart expert Michal Chapnick. She’s going to be talking about Walmart ad certification, new beta programs for Walmart, as well as Google ads for Walmart. So this and so much more on today’s episode of the Serious Sellers Podcast.

Bradley Sutton:

How cool is that? Pretty cool, I think.

Carrie Miller:

Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the Serious Sellers Podcast by Helium 10. My name is Carrie and I’m your host today, and this is our winning with Walmart Wednesday, where we talk about all things Walmart. We answer all of your questions and I’m very, very excited today because I have an amazing guest. We have Michal Chapnick, who is going to be joining me. I’m going to be asking her lots of questions because she’s a Walmart expert. She has a Walmart agency and she’s had a lot of success on Walmart. I know a lot of you are familiar with her. Hey, Michal, how’s it going?

Michal:

Hello, I’m good and good. How are you doing?

Carrie Miller:

Very good. Thank you, nice to see you, and thanks so much for coming on. I’m really excited to have you because you’re one of the you know Walmart gurus one of the few Walmart gurus. I would say, probably one of the top in the industry here for Walmart. So thank you. Yeah, so I’m really excited because I know that you have a lot of kind of cool updates to share with us. Okay, so I’m going to get into it. I’m going to get into some of the first things. I’m going to ask you just what kind of updates are there that you would like to share with us about Walmart? Do you want to share any updates of anything new for Walmart or what’s new?

Michal:

basically, I think there are so many Recently. You know, every week we do Walmart updates and we have, like you know, 10, 15 slides every week because they’re really on top of it, they’re working really hard and a lot of them are really exciting because and I’m telling that all the time Walmart really wants you. They want you on Walmart, they want the brand, they want you to sell and a lot of people you know sometimes having a hard time to enter Walmart or when they’re on Walmart they’re having a hard time to sell. But Walmart really wants you there and they’re doing everything they can from their side to help you and, you know, give you help to set up, give you help with fees. There’s always some kind of promotion there is doing for sellers that are already on Walmart or new sellers. So right now they’re doing a lot of like. They’re cutting off fees in different ways.

Michal:

So either if you have the Pro Seller badge and you can get deep discounts on fees and you can get credit that you can use it for run ads or to use it for the review accelerator program, so you get this credit back. The only thing you need to do is go to your BIS mentor. It’s in every account. It’s on the, I think, top left and Walmart is giving you customized suggestions so it just specifically for you.

Michal:

So from things like items that they think you have an opportunity to get more sales if you lower your price and they’re willing to cut your sell off fees, so they will cut your sell off fees so you’ll be able to take your price lower to sell more. So this is just one example of the second thing they will give you like a customized list of products that they think you should add to your account. So they’re basing that, based on the category you’re selling or the brand you’re selling. So if you’re a resale, of wholesale, you will see a lot of opportunities and I know that some of my sellers that I’m working with they’re taking really good advantage of those and they’re they managed to get a lot of sales because usually Walmart will tell you something that is out of stock or something that the other sellers are not using WFS.

Carrie Miller:

So once you got this inventory and it’s already selling very well and you’re the only one selling it or the only one WFS, imagine that is like so much self I actually talked to them about this and they said that they anything in the assortment growth tab, that those are really the best opportunities because they kind of compliment what they already have on Walmart. So they’re looking for complimentary products. So I think that’s why is they’re really going to. If you take those suggestions, they’re going to boost you and then you’re going to get a lot of exposure and sales. Like I know, I was talking to an account manager and she said that somebody in the toys category had a bunch of assortment growth suggestions for toys and they started manufacturing them and basically have been killing it on Walmart, just making tons and tons of sales. So that’s a that’s something that is really interesting right now for opportunity for selling products.

Michal:

It is working. I know that one of our clients that he have an account manager. You know in the past you know they were doing it personally, they know exactly the opportunity so they can do it all and you know he’s selling in the category of backpacks. They told him you know what styles right now there is like a lot of demand, for example, clear backpacks and things like that, and the same thing is killing they’re. They’re making six figures a month.

Michal:

They’re just amazing. So Walmart is there to help you. I think, if you, I don’t know I was selling on Amazon for 12 years, but I remember the 10 years ago. I used to get emails from Amazon every day with items to sell. They were like telling me hey, you know these these, you know those items right, and I don’t know if they still do that. I have no idea, but I haven’t gotten any recently. And but with Walmart is the same thing. They want to know.

Michal:

For them to get to the same or as close as Amazon sells, their catalog have to grow and that’s their focus. They’re focused in growing their catalog and they’re using the sellers, the third-party sellers, to leverage the catalog. There’s still far away in a couple of hundreds of millions of products from Amazon. There is so much place for new sellers and even people that come into Walmart and they’re new and they don’t know what to sell. I can show them so quickly. So much opportunities. There’s endless opportunities. One of the coolest things with the mentor base even if you’re a private label, walmart know you’re selling, for example, in the toy category or kitchen, and they know exactly what product, have a lot of demand and they will tell you. And then you need to go and manufacture that or source that or there’s so many ways you can get your hands on these items. This is one of the things that I really like, that they’re really encouraging you and we just talked about it.

Michal:

Right now they have an update for the category of automotive. They will tell you all the products they’re looking for in automotive and they tell you please bring those products, list them. We want you to create the listing. They do not want you to sell something. Yeah, of course you can sell. Something is already on Walmart but what they’re trying to do is to get you to create new listings. They want you to not just to create new listing. They also expect to need to create good listings, because when they’re good listing, they can be in front of customers. Customer can find them. When customer find it, the content is good, so he will buy it.

Michal:

Right now they give you the option to upload videos to your listing. Everybody can do that right now. It doesn’t cost you anything. You can just go ahead and there’s a when you go and open the case. There is one of the section it says upload rich media, upload video, and they will give you an instructions and a file to upload your video. So they’re really doing a lot for the sellers and going a little bit back. The most important things that you need to remember is that you have to follow the guidelines, because you’re going to have so much benefits coming after that, Getting the processor batch, for example. Now they’re offering the SEM, that’s the searching agent marketing, and what is that? So let’s talk about that for a second, because that’s I think this is one of the most exciting updates the last couple of months.

Carrie Miller:

Yeah, I saw it pop in my account and I took a look at it. I think my biggest question is because this is basically advertising through Google Shopping, through the portal, and they basically do it for you. As long as you’re really well optimized, you’ll show for the best keywords. But is this now the paid version of what was free? Because I remember my product used to show up a ton on Google Shopping just for free and I hadn’t been advertising on Google for Walmart but it would say available on Walmart.com. Is it now kind of paid and not free, or do you see both?

Michal:

No, it’s definitely both. So here’s the secret. Walmart is spending millions Even I wish I could see their budget for Google Ads. It’s insane, it’s really crazy. They know the power of Google Ads. We saw in many, many clients a lot of time when we went deep into the sales and trying to understand where those sales are coming from. Between 30% to 40% of a lot of item sales coming from Google Ads. So Walmart is pushing all the listing to Google Ads.

Michal:

But there’s a couple of criterias, like your listing have to be following the guidelines, you have to have good images, so you have to have not too long title and all the things that are very important, and you can see it in your listing score. There is a tool that show you exactly the score for every little part of your listing and if your score is high, there is no reason why you shouldn’t be eligible to show up on Google Ads. So Walmart is not going to put you on Google Ads if you don’t have enough images, because then the pain for your item to show up on Google a customer is going to click on that is going to come to Walmart and he’s not going to end up buying because there’s no information or there’s no images. So again, they have to make sure your listing is going to have the chance to convert before they will do that. So the only thing you need to do is make sure your listing is following the guidelines. And so now Walmart is telling you we’re giving you the option. We know how powerful is Google, we know how powerful the ads are coming. We are spending a lot of money, but if you want to do some extra, you want to spend more money, you want to put more product. We’re giving you the option to start doing campaigns on Google, and I think that’s huge and I think whoever is going to take advantage of that is going to see amazing results in their conversion rates.

Michal:

Because Still, 40 percent of people will start their search on Google. I think 35 percent going to go directly to Amazon, 40 percent on Search and Agent, and then the rest is spread on different things. Some people will go through Pinterest or even social media. They’re going to look and stuff in there. Another thing that why you want to be optimized is the same thing as more you optimize and you listen to high quality. Walmart is not just advertising on Google or Bing or Ad. They’re advertising with a lot of social media advertising, with a lot of bills website. They’re advertising with a lot of really big influencers that they’re paying them a lot of money. As more as you’re listening is good. They will expose your items to all those channels they’re advertising at.

Carrie Miller:

That’s possible. Yeah, I know that.

Michal:

Yeah, I was talking with one of the account manager and they have the option to pick items and put them on this bucket, this list, and then website deals website like a silk deals, and there’s all websites like that or influencers have the option to look at that list and pick the items they want to promote this week because they’re getting paid and they get also getting paid affiliates. Yeah, there’s things like that. Sometimes, if you follow influencers on Walmart on Instagram, they’re doing a lot of Walmart. You can see they’re pushing a lot of passion. Yeah, kitchen items. And right now it’s crazy because people are waiting for influencers to show them what’s the deals on Walmart, because everybody know that Walmart have the best Black Friday deals.

Michal:

Yeah, we always have the biggest selection, the biggest selection of deals in each category. Because other stores can be just electronics, best buy with Walmart. The Black Friday deals are on home, on outdoor, on Christmas decoration, toys, clothing, jewelry, everything. Walmart is very known in Black Friday.

Carrie Miller:

We did have a question about SEM. It says do you do Walmart SEM and your own Google ads at the same time? That’s a really good question Because if you don’t want to cannibalize your own Google ads while doing the SEM Google ads, that is a really good question.

Michal:

Usually, when you do your own Google ads, you choose where the traffic is going to go. You can run Google ads for your website. It’s good because many times I remember I had items that I used to sell in the past. There were not all of people were selling them In the category. I would say it was a kind of a shoes, a specific shoes for kids. When I used to go to Google and I used to write that specific keyword. I get Google ads and I sell my shoes on Walmart. Next to it I saw my shoes on my website and next to it on Amazon. I used to get all the Google ads I could. Now, most likely, the customer will buy my shoes. It doesn’t matter where, but he will buy them. Again, you’re creating brand awareness. It’s more ads you can create. It’s more exposure. You can put your brand in a product. It’s better for you because the customer remembered that.

Carrie Miller:

I think that they clarified it. I mean sending Google traffic to Walmart. Maybe not do your own Google ads to Walmart if you’re doing SEM, potentially.

Michal:

Yeah, that’s what it’s going to do. That’s exactly what it’s going to drive traffic from Google to your Walmart. So I say you know, try, try, you can put a budget. It’s not too complicated to run those campaigns. So I would say, give it a try. And before you do that, also go and search for your item on Google and see if it’s really coming up, if Walmart is already promoting your items. And again, the most important thing, make sure your listing is following the guideline.

Carrie Miller:

Yeah, for my own Google ads. I did do an experiment where I was trying to see if it would help with ranking if I sent outside ads, like from Google, like at U-Kan on Amazon, and I noticed that it did not make a difference when I sent my own Google ads to Walmart. And so I think that probably, if there is going to be a benefit, it’s probably going to be through the SEM program doing ads to Walmart. So if if I were to choose between the two, I would probably do the Walmart SEM over Google to my own Google ads to Walmart, whereas I would still obviously do Google ads because I have Google ads to my own sites as well. But that’s what I would think because I know that they are kind of looking at their own metrics and the more you convert on their side, I think that the better it is. But that could be just a guess, but I do know for a test that it did not help my rank. So there is that, because I know a lot of us do that for Amazon. We send Google traffic and it does help with rank, but it didn’t on Walmart.

Michal:

Yeah, one more thing I’m thinking of is that it’s probably going to be much better because they have better pricing, so it might be going to end up being much cheaper than you spend it yourself.

Carrie Miller:

Yes, it’s Walmart.

Michal:

It’s going for Walmart account. It’s not your Google account, it’s Walmart account having their own pricing. So you will get that. And the second thing it’s known because I can see it. Every time I go to Google I can see Google love Walmart. Google will always place Walmart ads in first five. So this is another thing you will get better exposure and you have better chance to shop in a better ad in a better location Because, again, it’s through Walmart. So just that it’s worth it.

Carrie Miller:

We have another question. Actually Bradley asked this one and it says is Walmart Canada worth it yet?

Michal:

I absolutely think so, absolutely. It is very like with Walmart.com, the same thing with Walmart Canada. Not every product will be a huge success because those marketplaces are still building their customer base, but I think Walmart.com is doing very good. Now for Canada, from a lot of people that I have a lot of friends that live in Canada people online. When they go online they usually will go either to Amazon Canada or Walmart Canada. There is not too many options. Some items people can go to the store and have some problems to find Like there is not always big selection of things. So if you know to find those items that people having a hard time to find in the store or next to their house, you will know that Canada will be very, very good.

Michal:

So actually, going back to the time when I used to sell kitchens, we had exact same styles on that farm in Canada and actually it was a period of time that we met sales on Canada. Because I guess you know people need, you know everybody needs shoes for their. Yeah, you don’t need to do much, it’s going to sell. If you have nice shoes with quality, it will sell. And I think the thing is that, again, people when they go online, they don’t. There’s not too many brands that are selling on Walmart.com or Canada. So again, if you find those opportunities and there is tons of opportunities on Walmart Canada and also in Canada people, the Canadian, are paying high prices on stuff, so you don’t have to sell nothing to cheap, you can sell it in your price or even higher and customers are paying and they’re also paying shipping as well, so I think the profit is also very nice on Canada.

Carrie Miller:

All right, let’s go into some other things I know. Can you give us some insights to you know, like I think, some beta programs I think coupons, brand stores, any other kind of beta programs that you’ve seen, and have you been able to use them and what’s your experience been with those?

Michal:

Yeah, so brand stores are available for very selected amount of sellers. Right now it’s mostly they started with a lot of sellers that do it fashion, so we do have a couple of our clients that they have the option to do brand stores and right now it looks great. I cannot wait for it to be available to everyone because we need that. You know you want to click on the brand and go to a nice storefront that you can display your. You know what are you selling. I think it’s going to help a brand grow really nicely on Walmart and I think the best part is, again we see the people that selling on Walmart. There’s not a lot of brands that take Walmart really seriously and doing those extra steps, but the one they do, those that want to see really success on Walmart. So I’m excited to you know, to see some of the brands we’re working with, you know, using that feature and growing. The second thing is coupon codes. So coupon codes again are in beta right now. Yes, and it’s available from whatever.

Michal:

Only like 50 sellers got that, yeah, maybe now a little bit more, but I cannot wait for that because, again, this is huge for doing social media marketing, because people love those videos and those ads and everything that you give them. Coupon code is, like, so popular right now with Amazon, and I think it’s going to help get so much more traffic and sales to Walmart when you can, you know, and display your items with the coupon code. I think so.

Carrie Miller:

I think that it’s a bummer we don’t have it right now because my sales when we started doing a coupon on Amazon have done really, really well, because I just think people are always looking for a deal. So, seeing that coupon, they’re like, oh, I might as well just get this item too in here because it’s on sale or there’s a coupon, whereas you know we don’t have it on Walmart yet. I’m kind of antsy to get coupons on Walmart. It would be really cool if they just decided next week to release those, because I’m desperately waiting for those because they work really well on Amazon. We see that they work because people are already shopping on there and they’re like, oh, I’m looking, they’re looking for deals, right? So the more access we have to give deals, I think, the more sales we’re going to make on Walmart.

Michal:

So, yeah, in beta anymore. It’s available to everyone. If you’re a brand, you have to be brand and register, but is the video ads. Yes is the most exciting thing I think happened recently for brands is that you can create a video ad and you get your customer attention so fast because you know the minute they search for something, your video is and it’s big, it’s really big. You saw on Walmart, it’s not like tiny. It’s like yes, really like the page. It’s really nice big deal, and I’m still amazed that so many brands are not using that. There are so many people and sellers that are not using the video ads or even just to upload the video to the listing. So many people are not doing that. So and so, yeah, this is I think the key to this with Walmart is paying attention and doing all this stuff. I agree.

Carrie Miller:

I think I’ve talked to some people and because the minimum is a dollar for the video ads, they haven’t been utilizing them. Have you started doing video ads and have you seen some good conversion on those, like just better conversion overall? Or what do you see with the video ads Currently?

Michal:

yeah, we do have one of our clients that is running video ads and their sales are are really going high, Like we’re talking about 30% more than before, so that’s really nice. They’re very happy with that, and so this is one of the things that you know with advertisement usually you should see growth and you know with sales.

Carrie Miller:

Mm, hmm, that would be. Yeah, that’s amazing. Okay, so let’s see, there was something else that you mentioned, and it was ad certification. Do you want to talk a little bit about Walmart ad certification? I think this is a completely new program, so yeah, that’s a new program that Walmart is.

Michal:

see that people struggling with ads Like they’re trying to run ads and they don’t know, they have no clue what they’re doing. So they’re saying, hey, let’s give you a certificate. So I think it’s just to make people feel like, oh, if they’re going to go through a course, they’re going to be certified and they know what they’re doing. So this is what they’re trying to do. Or they’re even offering that to your team. It doesn’t have to be you, it’s going to be somebody from your team. So if you have a VA, or because Walmart advertisement is not difficult, but you have to take the time and and learn how to create your campaigns correctly, how to optimize them, how to find the right keywords, a check your competition.

Michal:

If you’re running ads and you don’t spy on your only competitors to see what they’re doing, you’re missing out. Because this can be. I always find. When I do, you know, when I look at competitors, when we run ads for customers, we can always see that there is, we have a list of all the relevant keywords and then we look at the competitors and sometimes they’re missing one or two, or sometimes even more. And that’s your opportunity. So I think it’s just to make sure that you’re not missing out, and so we can always see that there is.

Michal:

We have a list of all the relevant keywords and then we look at the competitors and sometimes they’re missing one or two or sometimes even more. And that’s your opportunity, because nobody’s paying for that keywords and you can pay for it and get all the traffic. Or Another thing that I see all the time with the competitors is that they’re paying for a lot of phrases but they’re not coming out as relevant because they don’t have that phrase in the listing. So the ad algorithm is very smart, so he will sometimes place them for these keywords, but only because they don’t have somebody that looks more relevant. Once you come and you’re more relevant, you’re not really competing with him because you will always get the first spot in the first page because the algorithm know you’re relevant. So it’s easy. Even if somebody in your confederate is advertising sometimes they’re not doing such a good job you can always come and find those little holes where you can take advantage of something that your competitor is not doing.

Carrie Miller:

Very good, very interesting. Well, I think we’re pretty much at our time limit, but I was wondering if there’s anything else that we didn’t talk about that you might want to give advice on or share with the audience. Any final thoughts?

Michal:

Yes, I think through the end of the year. Right now it’s a really good timing for a lot, especially of the new seller, to see the potential of Walmart because a lot of them will be surprised right now with the sales. So I really want a lot of you to catch the momentum of the end of the year. Right now it’s the best timing to add new product because there’s a lot of traffic. So take the time and add new product. If you have a product they’re doing very well, sometimes you can even just create another offer. It can be two-pack, three-pack, it can be a bundle. Again, it’s more items you add, more customer can find you, you create more brand awareness. So add as many skills, as I always think is a good strategy to build your brand and stay in stock, even though pay attention, because a lot of people what happened right now? They’re getting out of stock because they didn’t thought they’re going to sell so many, so much on Walmart and they’re getting out of stock quickly. So try to stay in stock so you keep your momentum and your ranking. So add, advertise. Now is the best time.

Michal:

Advertise, pay attention to your budget. Make sure you’re running ads during those peak days and peak hours. You don’t run out of your budget too early of the day, so take advantage of the Google advertisement promo code. One thing that I wanted to say it’s going to be super cool when you run ads. So your item is showing up like write the first thing the customer seat and then you use a promo. Like promo it’s mean you’re doing something like reduce price. So your item right now instead of $29.99 is $24.99. So you already catching the customer eye because you can see this item is on sale and then they click on your product and then they see there is coupon code. Right, it’s going to be like. I think it’s going to create a lot of conversion.

Carrie Miller:

I think so too.

Michal:

Together, and so I cannot wait for the coupon code to come. But right now you can run ads, you can do promo and that’s going to catch some eyes. You will get a lot of sales just by doing that, as well as running ads going to help you get ranked. So this is a really good timing to not just sit back and say, oh, it’s too late. No, it’s not too late, you have enough time. Continue optimizing. Even right now. I’m telling all our customers please run a new keyword report.

Michal:

One of the things that people don’t do is everybody that listen right now. When the last time you optimize your listening maybe you upload a year ago did you optimize it since then? Keywords is something that change all the time, especially in Q4. Because in Q4 there’s a lot of new phrases. So if you sell toy for girls and right now you can add something to one of your key features, it says that toy make a great Christmas gift for girls. Christmas gift for girls is a very high search term at this time of the year and if you don’t use it, you’re missing out thousands of thousands of customers that potentially can come to your listening because that phrase is in your listening. So it’s the perfect time right now, today, or even if you’re on vacation or something next week, whenever you listen to that at any time.

Michal:

Go to Helium 10, run keyword refresh, keyword report to your product and do a couple of adjustments. Go and add those keywords to your description, to your title, even to your key features. Even your attributes can use some refreshment. Go to your listing tool score and see your score and see what you can improve in there. So just by doing that and you know what I love about it, that if you do that, you will see that in the next week or two you will get more traffic. It’s working, guys. I think this tip is always working.

Carrie Miller:

One more question on that Do you use Helium 10, Cerebro and Magnet to find those keywords, or where are you finding those keywords? Is that kind of the best option?

Michal:

I’m using both. So Magnet, we’re always doing searches just to see what’s coming up, and I always like to use Cerebro because I will go to my competing items. At least two or three of them will take their item number, go to Cerebro to see what they’re ranking for, which keywords, and almost always I will find the phrase that I never got in the other search. So always do both.

Carrie Miller:

Yeah, we’re updating those keywords every week, so you should be able to find new keywords on Helium 10, Cerebro and Magnet. So thank you everyone for listening. Thank you so much, Michal, for coming on. I always love having you on because you are definitely one of the top in the industry, so I appreciate you taking the time and answering questions and giving advice. So good luck to everyone who’s selling this Q4. I think we’ve gotten a lot of really great tactics here from Michal on what to do, from you know, for Q4. So we will see you all next time on Walmart Wednesday. So thank you.

Michal:

Bye Carrie. Thank you so much.

Carrie Miller:

Bye.


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Director of Training & Chief Evangelist

Bradley is the Director of Training and Chief Evangelist for Helium 10 as well as the host of the most listened to podcast in the world for Amazon sellers, the Serious Sellers Podcast. He has been involved in e-commerce for over 20 years, and before joining Helium 10, launched over 400 products as a consultant for Amazon Sellers.

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